Press Office

Aired: Sunday, 14 November, 2004 10:4
Sunday With adam Boulton

14^th November 2004

Interview with Nicholas Soames, MP, Shadow Defence Secretary

Adam Boulton : In the whole question of regiments and saving regiments as amalgamations, and rationalizations taking place would the Conservatives  really do anything different from what the government appears to be proposing?

Nicholas Soames : Well there is one very significant difference and that is that this entire operation is predicated on the governments decision to reduce infantry at a time when they have never been more busy or more needed by four battalions. The first thing that we would do would be to re-instate those four battalions immediately. And when we get in in May, God willing, we will stop the reduction of four battalions of the infantry. We support a lot of the ideas that are in the white paper about making the army more usable. We are not convinced by the big regiment idea. But we accept the fact that the army board must have their say in this, that is what they have been tasked by ministers. But it is wrong for the Secretary of State to hide behind the Army Board. He is a member of the Army Board and so is the Minister for the Armed Forces and essentially this is a political decision to alter the size and shape of the army, the actual decision is being made by the army board itself. We wait to see with some anxiety what will come out of it.

Adam Boulton : But the Black Watch itself, the amalgamation in Scotland would probably go ahead under the Conservatives wouldn’t it?

Nicholas Soames : The Black Watch are not going to be amalgamated we can only hope. The governments plan is to amalgamate the Kings own Scottish Borderers and the Royal Scots. That amalgamation we will stop going ahead if we get in in time. And, we will remain the six single battalions in Scotland under one umbrella. In the same way that the House Hold Division is operated where you have five regiments calling itself the House Hold Brigade.

Adam Boulton : This was a plan that was drawn up by General Sir Mike Jackson, do you think it is right for politicians, for what appears to be presentational reasons, to second guess the decisions that have been taken by the head of the army?

Nicholas Soames : No and that is why I said to you what I said at the beginning. This is a decision that will be taken by the Army Board, they have been charged with it by ministers but it is effectively a political decision by the ministers to go ahead and do this by themselves. And we shall wait with some interest as to what comes out of it.

Adam Boulton : You heard Geoff Hoon making it clear that following this policy of what George Bush calls ‘democracy and freedom around the world’ , that there may further be military interventions in other countries to back that up. Now George Bush is of course a right of center politician so if you did win that election in May, would you feel that it would be more likely that there would be more military ventures for the forces as we have seen under Tony Blair.

Nicholas Soames : I think it is very unlikely that there would be any less and we can see cropping up over the horizon other potentially operations perhaps in the Middle East and elsewhere. This is why I say Adam that the first place where we stand in difference with the government is that we think it is quite wrong to get rid of four battalions from the British Army. The Army has never been more in demand, nor has the air lift capacity of the Royal Airforce. Or indeed the ability of the Royal Navy to deliver our people all over the world. They are going to be very busy.

Adam Boulton : The suggestion is to find the funds and resources for that, perhaps we need to look at things like whether we need nuclear submarines for example.

Nicholas Soames : There is a great deal of work being done. For our own part we have already said that in our public expenditure plans we will be spending £2.7 billion more than Labour on defence when we get into power because we see the need to do so. You give the example of the submarines, that is a very fundamental question requiring so very very careful thought indeed. But the government is proposing to do away with six of the Navy’s Frigates. We are not going to let that happen and when we come into power we are going to re-instate the newest of the Type 23 Frigates before they are sold.

Adam Boulton : Now it fell to you when you were Armed Forces Minister to look at the whole question of Gulf War Syndrome. There is fresh research coming from veteran’s organizations in America that perhaps there is such a thing as Gulf War Syndrome affecting a substantial number of veterans from the first Gulf War. Are you now re-thinking your belief that Gulf War Syndrome doesn’t really exist?

Nicholas Soames : No I don’t think that we are but we are certainly watching very closely the results of the research. The research as I understand it from America, supposes that there may be a link in a chemical called Sarin. Whether or not that is true I don’t know, whether or not our soldiers were at any time exposed to Sarin I do not know and I would have to go back to re-visit the papers. But, it is clear that this is on going research, it is the obligation og the government to look after it’s veterans,there are people who are ill and suffered during the Gulf War but the reason for it is not clearly known yet. This research must go on. I understand that the government have said on reveiling this research that it doesn’t show evidence of the syndrome. But they have got to get to the bottom of it and I am sure they will.

Adam Boulton : Would you advise any young man or woman to pursue a career in the military looking at the risks, the level of likely reward, and indeed the year on year financial strain that there appears to be on people serving in the British military?

Nicholas Soames : I was a soldier myself for five very happy years. I loved every minute of it. I think soldiers, sailors and airmen join the finest armed forces in the world. They are very well looked after, they have a fascinating life, it is a wonderful career. It really is probably the most successful institution this country still has and despite the efforts of generations of politicians to screw it up, the armed forces remain in my judgment by far the most successful institution in the land and they do pound for pound, man for man, woman for woman, more good for the name and fame of our country than anything else that I can think of.

Adam Boulton : Given the doubts and criticisms that have been expressed since the Gulf War by the Conservatives of the conduct of the situation in Iraq, would it be fair to say that if the Conservatives were elected they would bring troops home quicker from Iraq than if Tony Blair’s government is returned?

Nicholas Soames : No I think we will bring our troops home when, as I imagine the government will do when the job is done. We are working towards as I heard the Secretary of state rightly say the end of this very bumpy period. The Fallujah business will be settled. The Americans are going to spend vast amounts of money in Fallujah to put it back on it’s feet. The elections will take place in January and it will be a very bumpy time between now and those elections. The enormous numbers of the coalition forces are now training Iraqi police, customs officers, the army, all personnel of a properly run state and when that is in place I hope and pray we will be able to withdraw. But of course it is going to be a bumpy time between now and then but we will go when the job is done.

Adam Boulton : Are you going to miss your shadow cabinet colleague Boris Johnson around the table?

Nicholas Soames : He is not only a colleague in parliament but he is a great personal friend and I am very sad for Boris. It is a very bad moment. But don’t lets forget that this is one of the most brilliant, amusing and interesting men of his generation. All I can say is that Boris’ political days are certainly not over. He has a wonderful constituency, he is a very good member of parliament, his constituents are fond of him and respect him very much. As indeed do a much wider circle in the country. I am very sorry that Boris has to go but he will dust himself down and crack on I’m sure.

 Adam Boulton : Do you think it was the right thing for Michael Howard to sack him?

Nicholas Soames : That is not a matter for me. It is a matter for the leader of my political party. He has decided that Boris must go and Boris will go. It is a sad day.

Adam Boulton : Nicholas Soames thank you very much.